The Case of Lesbians Who Don’t Reciprocate…
Pillow Princesses and Their Masculine Counterpart the Stone Butch
I’ll freely admit that I have never understood Pillow Princesses. You know, those sistas that have no problem with you putting in all of the work and bustin’ a sweat while they lay there and moan and groan at what seems to be preplanned intervals and then turn over and go to sleep once the deed is done.
Consider the following answer to how a Pillow Princess keeps her woman from feeling neglected from an admitted and proud Pillow Princess in an interview done in May of 2006:
Simple. You just use psychology. For example, it’s really true that flattery will get you everywhere. Make her feel like she just rocked your world. I usually say something like, “Oh my God, you stud.” I also like to feign catatonia and murmur: “Look what you’ve done to me.” My favorite is to make her get up and write down whatever it was she just did to me so she never ever forgets it. While she’s doing that, I take the opportunity to drift off to sleep, or just leave.
Something just doesn’t seem right to me about that.
The characteristics of a Pillow Princess are often times very similar to the Perpetrating Lesbian— a curious or bisexual woman, usually a fem, who wants to experience pleasure from oral sex, but who is unwilling to give it in return.
However, I feel it only right to point out that all Pillow Princesses aren’t fems, curious, or bisexual. I know quite a few studs (dominant lesbian, usually butch, often African American) that fall into that category as well. After doing some research, I discovered that the name for this type of lesbian is a Stone Butch. Who knew?
According to About.com’s Lesbian Life website, a Stone Butch is a lesbian who gets her pleasure from pleasing her partner. She does not like to be touched sexually.
I was involved with two such women, it didn’t work out.
The first was a stud who was definitely a lesbian, I never questioned that. However, absolutely under no circumstances did she desire for her partner to pleasure her. Her G spot was off limits permanently.
The second was also a lesbian, but in her defense, at 44, she still suffered from intense internalized homophobia which had an odd way of rearing its ugly head (no pun intended), whenever it was time to do the do. I credit that homophobia with being the reason why she could never be a receiver.
It’s very easy to figure out the deal with your average fem, curious, or bisexual Pillow Princess. As discussed previously, most are just killing time with women until Mr. Right starts acting right, gets out, or comes along. But it’s not so easy to figure out the mechanics behind our more masculine sistas who behind closed doors, turn into the stud version of a Pillow Princess. In fact it’s baffling to me. I mean they can’t all be suffering from or with internalized homophobia. Can they?
While perusing About.com’s Lesbian Life website, I came across the following question from a Stone Butch reader:
I consider myself a butch lesbian. In the course of discussing this and discovering it myself several years ago, my therapist suggested I am "stone." She suggested this because I ache and long and burn to give pleasure, while finding it difficult to receive. The thought of it causes me to cringe. Not in disgust, but fear…
…It frightens me to think of allowing someone, a woman, to touch me in order to allow them to give… it comes down to faking it on my part. I do not FEEL pleasure in being touched. But women seem to be unable to grasp that I truly do not ache and long to be touched and "loved". This is not helping me because I am not being heard when I talk and dare to be honest about my experiences. I have in my few relationships swallowed my discomfort and my grief and allowed the woman I was with to touch me, to "give" to me… even though I had done all I could to plainly explain that the only thing that gets me off is giving pleasure and satisfaction just those words.
…Is it "wrong" that I get my "zing" from giving HER a "zing?…”
Maybe it’s just me, but I thought one of the normalcy’s of being a lesbian was the act of being a lesbian. Hello? And I thought that act included oral sex. I guess this is true for some but not all of us. You learn something new everyday.
I guess a Stone Butch and Pillow Princess is a match made in heaven, but not for mwah.
This isn’t hateration on those sistas either, it’s simply knowing what works and doesn’t for you and being empowered enough to put it out there early enough in the conversation before someone ends up being very disappointed and time that you can’t get back is wasted.
Agree or disagree?
Not Just An Issue for Lesbians
While having this discussion with a group of friends, one of them, a gay man, told me that this was also an issue in the gay community as well, but of a different sort.
His issue was with men who while up in da club gave you the image and attitude of being a thugged out top but that after you got to know them and decided to take it there, found out that he was more passive than you were in the bed. He said that lack of honesty from the beginning has been the downfall of many a relationship. Who knew? I won’t even pretend to understand what that’s all about, but for my gay readers, feel free to weigh in on it.
My heterosexual brothas took the time to point out to me that Pillow Princesses were more of a phenomenon in their world, and after careful consideration, I’d say they’re probably right. The missionary position (man on top) doesn’t exactly call for much on behalf of the woman except to lie there. And since that has been the preferred and morally correct position of choice for many generations and subconsciously passed down as what is acceptable during sex, don’t be surprised if she talks the talk but can’t walk the walk. Don’t let the lyrics to some of these rap songs lead you to believe that everyone gets down like that.
In an attempt to better understand my Stone Butch sistas, can you please enlighten me on why you don’t care to be on the receiving end?
Pillow Princesses, what’s the deal with giving?
Everyone else, get in where you fit in.
And now for the disclaimer…No, all Pillow Princesses aren’t Perpetrating Lesbians, curious, fem, or bisexual. It is however, my opinion that most of them are. And we know all about opinions…
FOLLOW UP TO MY CALL FOR PERPETRATING LESBIANS
Just to give you a quick update on my call for Perpetrating Lesbians to enlighten us…I’m still waiting. Don’t be scared…
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This is good stuff Jasmyne!!! I love it! Thanks for calling them out proper and correct. Im waiting to hear from em’ too! They just don’t get the fact that it’s give and take. Not just take! Pillow P’s you can get into a worlds of trouble with the little games you play…Thankfully my partner and I don’t have those woes. But that leads me to wonder if other Lesbian Couples do…? Can a serious commitment survive with one half being a pillow p?
I don’t understand it either.
How a butch lesbian does not want to be touched. I personally love to taste it, touch it, lick it, suck it, smell it, hell crawl inside it and just live there, if I could LOL. And whoever I happen to be doing most definitely better want to do the same to me, or her azz won’t be going to loveland with me again.
Again, I just don’t get it.
On the gay male “passive” issue… I personally have no problem with the “homothug/butch” bottoms whatsoever! I don’t think it’s necessarily “false advertising,” unless of course they’re talking game in the streets and then filp-flop in the sheets. And on the other hand there are also “fem” boys who top exclusively. Just goes to show, you can’t get caught up on image only.
But I’d like to think that when there is a true connection between two people, the physical intimacy is wholly reciprocal, and “bedroom roles” aren’t binary.
All I have to say is can you say Atlanta. I moved to Atlanta around 3 1/2 years ago. Im a lesbian (no labels) and I have dated 3 different women two of whom have been quote un qoute fem. and the other in between like me just – someone who loves women. Ok – everyone in Atlanta ( african-american) is either Fem or Butch and guess what your average Butch wont allow a Fem to touch them. I don’t think it’s Homophobia it’s the whole control issue with Studs- if I make some noise in bed then I’m less of a stud and it’s my job to please my women. I am currently in a relationship with a women who didnt know how to give because for so long Studs have been telling her no. I’m like the hell with that – Either Studs have never ever experienced an Orgasism or they are afraid to look less than butch. I personally love for a women to touch it, lick it and even rub on it if she knows how.
I love the fact that you brought up this subject because I’m tired of the 69 I owe you one Women.
It seems to me that whatever someone wants to do in bed is ok as long as they and their sexual partner agree on it. And I find it disconcerting that someone has to conform to a stereotype of how a “lesbian” should be in bed. That seems to be the same kind of hateration that straight folks want to impose on us. You can’t just assume that what you like is what everyone else likes…As for the whole perpetrating lesbian thing, what does it matter if you’re not sleeping with one? You can not save people from themselves. If a “stud” feels like she wants a women who’s sexuality is questionable, then more power to her. I can guarantee you that she knows what she’s getting into.
I am so interested to hear there is a term for this “Stone Butch” phenomenon. I was with a couple such women, and really didn’t comprehend it. I guess if I had to pick a label I would kind of say I’m a switch hitter
I definitely appear very femme, but I will go from “top” to “bottom” in a heartbeat, and I like my women the same way. I feel sexually claustrophobic in a relationship where I can’t receive AND give on a regular basis. I do enjoy giving, but I haven’t had the experience of getting off so much on giving that it brings me to orgasm (yet. 
LOVE when that day finally comes- pun intended 
). The concept of never having an orgasm during my sexual experience just somehow seems dissonant to me.
So given that I have a question for the self identified stone butches: Does giving pleasure in that way actually bring you to orgasm, or do you enjoy it but never have orgasms in the sexual interactions you have? And if you don’t is there a reason why you don’t want one (or several) ‘Cause in my experience of it –who wouldn’t want an orgasm? With the women I was with who were like that I eventually came to understand from them that it was about vulnerability and a loss of a feeling of control. Somebody making them cum opened them up in a way that scared them.
Is that the general consensus of most stone butches or was that just a them thing? Is there another reason you are not interested in climax? Do you climax in other ways outside of your interactions i.e. self stimulation? I know these are very intimate questions, but I am very interested to hear what my sisters have to say about this. I hope someone will take the time to share.
What side of the coin do you think The Queen falls on?
http://blogs.bet.com/entertainment/spotlight/2007/12/01/queen-latifah-to-marry-girlfriend/
Jasmyne asked: “ it’s not so easy to figure out the mechanics behind our more masculine sistas who behind closed doors, turn into the stud version of a Pillow Princess…they can’t all be suffering from or with internalized homophobia. Can they?”
My answer: No. There are many reasons that can account for it_having absolutely Nothing to do with homophobia in any way!
Jasmyne wrote: “Maybe it’s just me, but I thought one of the normalcy’s of being a lesbian was the act of being a lesbian.”
WoW_that’s deep_because quite frankly trying to determine the “act” of “normalcy” for ANY lesbian other than MYSELF is way beyond my abilities!
Truthiz, some lesbians are just fine with the “pillow princess” dynamic in their relationship. And if it works for them, who am I question their “normalcy” OR their “lesbianism”_?!
Like me, some lesbians are only interested in having a mutually exclusive 1-to-1 Monogamous relationship. Other lesbians prefer a more ‘Open” relationship w/multiple lesbians. Again, if it works for them, who am I to question that?!
The problem arises when one_or both_partners Fail to _either communicate effectively what the REAL deal is_and/or get a thorough Understanding of the information that should be shared BEFORE entering into a relationship.
Both parties MUST be Open and Honest with each other from day # 1…that’s the key! When things are left to “fester” the relationship will eventually began to fall apart.
Equally important is the Fact that people tend to suffer a TON of grief, and mental/emotional anguish trying to Conform to the “norms” of others!
I remember my teen-thru-late 20s very well!
I can’t find any excuses for partners who refuse to reciprocate. Sex is give and take, and if it goes into one direction all the time then there’s a problem..
It’s ok if a partner isn’t into oral sex or something..but there are so many other ways to pleasure back a partner, that if you just lay there then that makes that person a “user”.
As an adult_and more importanly, as a gay Black female, I will reject ANY attempt by anyone to intrude in My bedroom and dictate or define how I and my Significant other Choose to express Our intimacy!
Am I a “Stone Butch” or “Pillow princess”?
No!
But I’m d*mn fed-up with the [K]hristian Reich and other HOMOBIGOTS who’ve made it their mission to wreack hovac on the lives of “gays and lesbians”. For decades they’ve stood in Judgement of Us, trying to dictate WHO we should Love and HOW we should love!
So now members of the gay and lesbian communities are embracing a similar mentality???!
And IF I don’t “agree” with whatever is going on in Your bedroom, that means that You and your mate are wrong??? So I can judge you???
H*LL NO!
…because it’s YOUR life_and I have NO right in Your business! That’s between You and your mate!!!
You have EVERY right to Love whomever you choose, HOWEVER you choose_as long you’re NOT hurting (or infringing upon the rights of) others!
“I guess if I had to pick a label I would kind of say I’m a switch hitter
I definitely appear very femme, but I will go from “top” to “bottom” in a heartbeat, and I like my women the same way. I feel sexually claustrophobic in a relationship where I can’t receive AND give on a regular basis. I do enjoy giving, but I haven’t had the experience of getting off so much on giving that it brings me to orgasm (yet. 
LOVE when that day finally comes- pun intended 
). The concept of never having an orgasm during my sexual experience just somehow seems dissonant to me. ”
Yea that. What she said. I’m way new to all this, a few months ago had no clue what a top or bottom was for goodness sake – but I’ve got a few good friends who have filled me in on the details and I find it extremely interesting that on some levels there seem to be more rigidly defined sexual roles in the lesbian community than I ever encountered in the straight community!
Interesting…
“I guess if I had to pick a label I would kind of say I’m a switch hitter
I definitely appear very femme, but I will go from “top” to “bottom” in a heartbeat, and I like my women the same way. I feel sexually claustrophobic in a relationship where I can’t receive AND give on a regular basis. I do enjoy giving, but I haven’t had the experience of getting off so much on giving that it brings me to orgasm (yet. 
LOVE when that day finally comes- pun intended 
). The concept of never having an orgasm during my sexual experience just somehow seems dissonant to me. ”
Yea that. What she said. I’m way new to all this, a few months ago had no clue what a top or bottom was for goodness sake – but I’ve got a few good friends who have filled me in on the details and I find it extremely interesting that on some levels there seem to be more rigidly defined sexual roles in the lesbian community than I ever encountered in the straight community!
Interesting…
If you are with a woman who refuses to touch you our give you live, you have a problem. Nuf said.
Would somebody please direct me to the page in the LGBTQ handbook where it says certain topics are off limits for conversation? It would also help if you would cite the duly elected committee members who passed that resolution ‘cause I didn’t get so much as an absentee ballot on any of that……
And while we’re on the subject, and please make note, a “HOMOBIGOT” is someone who hates homosexuals. There’s been none of that, here. Just attempts, on some folk’s part, to shut down conversations. To my way of thinkin’, that’s another kind of bigotry – the censorial kind.
Seems to me, that we owe it to ourselves, TO HAVE certain conversations – even if this means tolerating a measure of discomfort. This isn’t a job for the faint hearted. This IS us defining our own Culture, right on down to our own particular sexual neighborhoods. Would it be better to have White folks and psychiatrists decide our business FOR US?
Nobody is trying to tell anybody else what to do in the privacy of her (his) own bedroom. That’s a bogus charge.
I’m just not the type to suspend my own judgement about things on somebody elses say so. If you can’t discuss your bisexuality or stone-ness, or even your lesbianism, without being hostile and/or defensive, I’m suspicious…..
i agree with angela’s post december 6th. i don’t think that the homothug/butch who is passive in the bedroom is necessarily “false advertising.” unless they explicitly call themselves tops or thugs in bed, etc when they’re talking about themselves. then it’s just kind of, well, strange when they turn out to be the opposite of what they said – trust and honesty becomes an issue at that point.
on another point, i consider myself a feminine/queer lesbian. i love giving and i love receiving. i have been with all different kinds of women – some don’t like penetration, some do, some don’t want anything in return at all, some want it all. the most satisfying relationships i’ve had were those with mutual sex. the other relationships felt… well… like they were missing something. i want to make my lover feel the way she makes me feel, emotionally and physically.
i HAVE been in a pillow princess relationship, where i was the princess and my lover was the strapon butch. i know everyone’s different, but this was not satisfying for me. in that situation, my lover told me she loved fucking me and didn’t care to get fucked particularly. it made me feel really weird that she just wanted to fuck me and didn’t want anything back from me. “maybe she doesn’t like me,” i thought. so i just let her fuck me while i “moaned and groaned” and thought about what the hell was going on with us. when i think back on it, i was totally intimidated by her and lost in the uncomfortable power dynamics of the situation. it didn’t turn out good. my experience as a pillow princess was pretty damn shitty. if my lover doesn’t want my fucking, how can this turn me on??
Confessions of the Pillow Queen: Sexual Practices & Queer Fem-ininites
Laura A. Harris
Abstract:
Rarely does the term “Pillow Queen” refer admiringly to a mode of female or feminine lesbian sexual agency; most often it is used as a term of insult. If a good portion of feminist and queer studies works from a history and theory of the sexually abject then why is the Pillow Queen an improper historical sexual subject? Not only has the Pillow Queen been neglected by queer studies, she has been ridiculed and rejected by many forms of lesbian feminism within which the spectacle of seeming feminine passivity can evoke only horror and intimations of deep collusion with the forces of patriarchy.
What’s wrong, I ask, with being a Pillow Queen?
On http://www.About.com, which promises to be your online guide to lesbian life, PQ-dom is defined as:
A Pillow Queen is someone who likes to be on the receiving end of sex.
She likes to be pleasured and not reciprocate. Also known as: Bottom.
This definition of the PQ as someone who likes to receive, be non-reciprocal, and who can also be called a “bottom” indicates the troublesome sexual peculiarities of the PQ, who, as the spectacle of an idle female (feminine) bottom, receiving pleasure, demanding pleasure, luxuriating in pleasure but then, unbelievably, outrageously, refusing to “reciprocate” tells us all we need to know about the lesbian repudiation of the category. The PQ, here and elsewhere, has been classified as self-serving, as a sexual subject who seeks out pleasure but does not return it. However, if articulated from a feminist and queer theory of sexuality PQ-dom not only provides a model of sexual agency for both straight and queer femininities, it also offers us a complex rendering of the relations between passivity and pleasure, receptivity and subjectivity, sexual behavior and politics.
Of course, lesbian femininity is a curious topic within feminist and queer theories and has been much neglected when compared to the mountains of literature on gay male femininities and lesbian masculinities. A few studies by scholars have laid the foundations for an account of lesbian femininity as an excessive, hyperbolic, non-normative mode of desire. However, in part as a result of the PQ’s “outsider” lesbian status as too ‘naturally’ feminine queer theories haven’t granted her due appreciation as a potential model of transgressive bottoming. In fact, only a few queer theorists have written specifically about the desire to bottom or to be the receptive partner and none of them use the PQ as an example.
In this essay I argue that though the Pillow Queen is often viewed as an historical symbol of a straight-acting, lazy or self-involved, ethnic/racial/classed femininity, as a politically incorrect affront to lesbian feminism, and as marginal to radical queer theories, in my analysis, as she works the glorious fulfillment of countless fantasies of femininity, submission, and passivity the Pillow Queen must be celebrated and installed at the very heart of a queer feminist project situating femininity and sexual transgression.
This article is featured in Tribades, Tommies and Transgressives; History of Sexualities: Volume I.
“Maybe it’s just me, but I thought one of the normalcy’s of being a lesbian was the act of being a lesbian. Hello? And I thought that act included oral sex. I guess this is true for some but not all of us. You learn something new everyday.”
What the fuck is “normalcy”? Who the fuck is “normal” and who the hell gets to define it? The majority? Fuck the majority.
That’s like saying you’re not a real gay man unless you like taking it in the ass. Everyone does not like oral sex. Whether het, lez, or gay. It’s stupid to think that. Just because YOU don’t understand, does not mean something is wrong. I am a pillow queen and I only date Stone Butches for this reason. We are compatible. Period. I would never try to manipulate someone into giving me what I want. The woman quoted using “psychology” probably hasn’t found the person who will complement her in the bedroom, or doesn’t know that stone butches even exist, perhaps.
As a pillow princess my job is not to educate you. If you want to know I suggest you go read a book, a website…it’s free. Try googling “stone femme”. Go to butch-femme.com …forums galore of stone butches and pillow princesses explaining their identities.
But do know that I am a feminist queer lesbian femme who loves studs/butches who are touch-me-nots/stone. You can think I’m self-hating and lazy and in denial all you damn well please, it’s no different from straight folks who complain they can’t “understand” the queers.
Peace.
I think I’ve been with a “stone butch” before, but she was bisexual. She only wanted to use a vibrator on me, and wouldn’t let me so much as kiss her.
It was confusing for me, since I didn’t know about this phenomenon, and I very much wanted to please her, as well.